Flanking Heck! What happened to flankers and why are they not like they used to be?

slpfrsly said:

Now, this is fascinating, in part because I have been seeing more of this 'fragbro' used derisively. There's definitely something to unpack there. However, I think it's best saved for a different thread, to save this one from going way off track.

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@Redneck Perfumisto introduced the concept of "fembro hell" in the chanuary thread which perhaps, as a concept, which if further explored, might be the savoir of the entire bro community of frag and performace anxiety?

The term fembro, and correct if I'm wrong, is a portmanteau of "female" or "feminine'' with "brother" (abbreviated colloquially as "bro"), and it underscores a nuanced etymological relationship that reflects broader trends in contemporary digital and subcultural vernaculars; the opposition and introduction of an outside culture, such as a more diverse appreciation for fragrances, in a bro space. As such, it could be a linguistic innovation that serves not only as a means of in-group and out-group identification but also for cultural negotiation and the reimagining of social categories as a sort of anti-bro, but still-included-in-the-bro-realm alternative category?

Could the dichotomous concepts of "fembro", although less established, and "fragbro" begin to converge, underscoring a dialectical synthesis that Simone de Beauvoir might have conceptualized as an embodiment of the "other" within the self? Then, the acceptance of more diverse quality of fragrances such as the fleeting, sweet and fresh fragrances within the "fragbro" community, traditionally eschewed for their perceived weakness, becomes a testament to the Beauvoirian notion that identity—much like fragrance—is neither fixed nor inherent but is instead a fluid construct, shaped by cultural, social, and interpersonal dynamics. As such, the focus on performance could be diversified in the community as a result of this convergence.

Paul-Michel Foucault's ideas on power relations and the formation of knowledge systems offer an alternative lens. If "fembro hell" is indeed embraced by the fragrance community, can it be seen as a subversion of established "scent narratives," challenging the hegemonic discourse that dictates which fragrances are appropriate for bros? Foucault’s concept of "biopower" is mirrored in the way scent influences behavior and identity perception, suggesting that the liberation of fragrance preferences could signify a broader emancipation from rigid, binary constructs of performing and non-performing fragrances, and a higher appreciation for more diverse aspects.

The Spartan ethos of camaraderie should also be explored in this context and perhaps offer another model. It was characterized by a profound bond forged by shared endeavors despite differences, which applies to the digital fragrance community in certain situations don't you think?

So the narrative of "fembro hell" should not only be about the acceptance of diverse olfactory preferences but a profound commentary on identity, camaraderie, and the human condition. After all, the only thing longer lasting than Spartan loyalty is the scent trail of Baccarat Rouge 540, leaving an impression as indelible as a Spartan's well-oiled glock.

So perhaps the @Redneck Perfumisto concept of "fembro hell" is a sign of more inclusive olfactory culture? Perhaps this concept is something to explore further.

@baklavaRuzh Thank you for your thoughtful post.

I speak as a proud gay man when I say I will speak forcefully against shaming effeminate men and alluding to anything like hell in relation to them.

Hawaii Jake said:

@baklavaRuzh Thank you for your thoughtful post.

I speak as a proud gay man when I say I will speak forcefully against shaming effeminate men and alluding to anything like hell in relation to them.

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Hi Jake! I think it's probably helpful to go back and read the complete conversation where the term was coined.


I was commiserating with @Bavard, a fellow male wearer of "pour femme-labeled fragrances". He was getting flak from his wife for wearing mostly feminine fragrances during our Basenotes "Chanuary" project. She was hoping he would be wearing mostly designated masculines. The term "hell" was being used to describe her perspective of having to put up with her husband wearing feminine fragrances for yet another month. The idea - would she trade a month of suffering her husband wearing nothing but feminines, for another month of her husband wearing only "pour homme" fragrances?

The term "fembro", as @baklavaRuzh correctly states, references the idea of "fragbro" (which one could argue that some, most, or even all male fragrance enthusiasts are), but more specifically those male fragrance enthusiasts who wear designated feminine scents, such as me and @Bavard. Some see the original term (fragbro) as derisive, but I don't, and if people considered me a "fragbro" or a "fembro", I'm cool with it. Where the latter term goes from there is in the hands of us all, but I think that @baklavaRuzh has given it a good start by way of pondering whether it balances "fragbro" in some potentially positive fashion. I can say this - the term was never intended to be a slur. It was being used in a very specific context.

The subsequent post where I used the term again is basically insider improv, riffing on Basenotes sync-world mixed with giving Marvelwood a well-deserved wedgie. Hopefully that makes sense, but if it doesn't, don't worry. It wasn't intended badly.

Chanuary was a lot of fun, but I can imagine that the conversation (between a bunch of people who have in many cases known each other for years) is mostly nuance at times.

All that said, I now want to consider the term as @baklavaRuzh is thinking about it, and see where that goes!

@Redneck Perfumisto Mahalo nui loa (thank you very much). The elucidation is appreciated.

baklavaRuzh said:

Could the dichotomous concepts of "fembro", although less established, and "fragbro" begin to converge, underscoring a dialectical synthesis that Simone de Beauvoir might have conceptualized as an embodiment of the "other" within the self? Then, the acceptance of more diverse quality of fragrances such as the fleeting, sweet and fresh fragrances within the "fragbro" community, traditionally eschewed for their perceived weakness, becomes a testament to the Beauvoirian notion that identity—much like fragrance—is neither fixed nor inherent but is instead a fluid construct, shaped by cultural, social, and interpersonal dynamics. As such, the focus on performance could be diversified in the community as a result of this convergence.

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This causes me to think much broader about the use of gender preferences in marketing perfume. We are taught to prefer certain fragrances the same way we are taught to act either male or female according to our cultures.

baklavaRuzh said:

So the narrative of "fembro hell" should not only be about the acceptance of diverse olfactory preferences but a profound commentary on identity, camaraderie, and the human condition. After all, the only thing longer lasting than Spartan loyalty is the scent trail of Baccarat Rouge 540, leaving an impression as indelible as a Spartan's well-oiled glock.

So perhaps the @Redneck Perfumisto concept of "fembro hell" is a sign of more inclusive olfactory culture? Perhaps this concept is something to explore further.

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I can see that using diverse perfumes can enlarge our own concept of self especially if those perfumes go against prevailing cultural norms.

Thank you for helping me understand that instead of a slur, "fembro hell" might be a finger in the eye of the dominant gender binary.